@percolator: No problem, I miss the preview function too, but it’s a bit snarky with newer builds of wordpress, but I appreciate your comments, as I’ve always. :)

I do think that Malaysiakini’s done a fine job of engaging bloggers - heck, not just bloggers, but internet websurfers - I suppose because it is catering to its core audience and it’s more participatory as far as news and opinion is concerned. I counted a few letters from bloggers, and one or two opinion pieces from others as well. That whole sidebar thing its got going is cool, and a great feature!

Isn’t it funny how a more inclusive news portal like Malaysiakini is able to really engage online opinion than our other mainstream media? Maybe the NST or theStar should take a page or two off of the BBC’s or the Guardian’s playbook!

That aside, I raised an eyebrow when I heard how All-Blogs paid DSAI a visit. But after our discussion here in this thread, I’m wondering how neutral an association can be.

Because to be completely inclusive is, as you point out, not possible - but to strive to be everything for everyone is to dilute the point of such an association’s existence in the first place. If the association stands for the broadest of objectives, then it stands for nothing in particular at all, don’t you think? Protecting bloggers against legal action is fine, and is specific. But what about promoting blogging?

I mean, what does promoting blogging actually mean? Blogging isn’t a manufactured phenomenon except where corporations, bands, people, etc. who want to engage their customers, audience, etc. are concerned, is it? Isn’t blogging a habit, interest, fad, etc. that people take up because they want to?

What does “promoting blogging” mean?! In the end, there are only two things “promoting blogging” can mean to me, i.e. the promotion of the veracity of the content of some blogs. And these blogs are the ones that purport to be alternative media/news portals. And the only ones I can think of in the Malaysian context as “alternative” news/media portals are so-called “socio-political” websites like Malaysia-Today and Screenshots.

The only other thing “promoting blogging” means to me is encouraging corporate types etc. mentioned above to engage their audience online via blogs (why blogs? we’ve got myspace and facebook!).

Bah, I don’t know. I talked about how the MSM and the government are making a mountain out of a molehile of the term “blogger”.

I’m beginning to suspect we bloggers think too highly of the term, too.

(See? We’re both navel-gazing, but with some sense, I’d like to think. See, Mr Ooi??)

And yet, deep down, it does irk me, terribly. Whose voices have all this while been left out from the traditional media? Who feels alienated? And now, whose voices are being ignored by this band of bloggers who purport to represent and speak for ALL bloggers? ‘ALL’ is, after all, a mighty big concept!

Of course, as hard as any group or media may try to be inclusive, it cannot be all things to all people. Yet, how do groups inspire connection without compromising core values? Malaysiakini shows the way. They’ve developed relationships in the blogging community and brought bloggers into the conversation by introducing that sidebar for blogs. That conversation -– with everyone representing themselves – is another way to serve readers and democracy. It’s a simple way of inviting people to be all things to each other. As a result, they’ve increased diversity in their readership, attracted new audiences and still do a fine job of informing people along the way.

On the apolitical factor, I wonder why that meeting that formed that protem committee for AllBlogs was held in NPC when an alternative site was offered. The one thing people tend to miss out when trying to align common interests is that, practicalities aside, there are symbolic aspects that need to be congruent to the claimed goals of unity. In that light, why be surprised that, that subsequent visit to Anwar at PKR’s office has become an issue?

The need for an association? I guess JO does have a point about helping train bloggers who have aspirations about being part of the force that can change our society, governance, considering the Malaysian mediascape and its climate.

Ay, Lucia, yeah it’s me. That BUM night, yeah I know. Well Done!

p/s: sorry xpyre, seeing as how I stopped navel-gazing, pardon the mental diarrhoea here. thanks for reinstating the ‘preview’

this time i intend to take a bit more time in KL instead of the rushed job last week.

The Monsterblog organ thing was funny though :P

I guess Monsterblog can forever deny that but seems no one wants to believe.

But does it matter? After so many months, I don’t think so anymore.

Blah.

Regarding labels, I think it’s just a matter of local blogs catching on in real life. Politics101 wrote something about cliques and I think s/he is right on that . Ultimately we hang out with those we want to hang out with, be it online, offline, business, politics, school, friends, work.. for reasons known only to themselves.

So…. what are we talking about again? :D :D

p/s: If you ever come to KL again, would you care to meet up>

FYI, percolator, the recent gathering on 19 may has NOTHING to do with bloggers united or all-blogs. it was a gathering initiated by a few individual bloggers, not associated with bloggers united/all-blogs. howsy was the one who mooted the idea to me and both of us decided to organise one, then others were roped in.

I guess it doesn’t irk me so much if they choose not to respond, because I’m ambivalent in my support for such an association. I just don’t see many positives (except having support against legal action, if it happens at all). More to the point: I wonder if bloggers at large are happier to be left alone. And that’s not counting how some might not like to be seen, by association, to belong to a group that has such a political bent.

You’re spot-on about riding the “wave of support following the Bloggers United thing”!

The apparent “demand for an answer” thing, in as much as we love the freedom of being able to dish out opinions, rants, criticisms and decisions even, at the click of a mouse, naturally we must expect to deal with equally pressing requirement for response as well.

As easily as AllBlogs was formed and protem committe elected, it really should be just as easy to say upfront, at least something like “hang on folks, we hear you, we’ll get back to you soon”.

Appearing to ignore, not addressing it directly and instead seemingly dismissing it by derisively alluding to dramatisation can come across as a number of things: rubbishing? condescension? a form of ’silencing’ in its implied ‘not worth a direct response’… what else?. It’s just a matter of transparency, really.

Whatever happened to embrace and engage (I know it’s BUM’s tagline, but nontheless relevant to AllBlogs) when you don’t want to acknowledge those other voices, don’t want to give credence, don’t want to converse, simply because they ask questions you aren’t ready, can’t or won’t answer?

Is anybody really asking for a definitive answer? I think the ratioonal ones would be satisfied with an indication that hey, we can talk about this.

The learning to be gotten from the robust debates/conversations, from the differences and diversity in blogosphere, if this is not managed properly for want of strong leadership, can be a real lost opportunity for blogging in Maalaysia.

p/s Me terrible typist. you ditched the preview function?

At first I thought Monsterblog was the official government organ backed by NST, but now I’m not so sure. And now AllMalaysia.info is backed by theStar and Genting. So I’m wondering who or what is behind it. Either way, the tussle in Malaysia’s online space is getting interesting, if not heated.

@percolator: I’m definitely hoping all these associations, for what they’re worth, don’t turn out to be elitist. I’m not even sure if it is, because there’s not much information beyond the two stated objectives so far. So all of this might be a storm in a very small teacup. I wish they managed information better, and rode the wave of support following the Bloggers United thing a bit better, but I guess that’s hindsight talking.

Like you said, credibility will be much helped if there isn’t so much mystery surrounding it. On the other hand, I do echo the sentiment that All-Blogs is in its infancy, so demanding an instant answer might not be possible.

The internet is egalitarian, and the recent backlash, whether spurred by certain parties or encouraged by opportunists with an agenda, is ample proof of this.

It remains to be seen how All-Blogs will respond.